Grace, I am pretty much where you are on this. I think whether it is this issue, or any other issue in the church, there are people who are sincere in their beliefs and actions, but mistaken (indeed at some level we are all in this on some issue, just different issues for different folks), those who are charlatans and there is the active work of the Holy Spirit.

God is more powerful than our imagination, our flesh is very deceptive, and the enemy has great deceptive powers – add all that up and it’s hard to know what’s “real” or not. At the same time, we really aren’t to pur ourselves into the position of judge. The whole thing definitely makes my head spin.

jerry,
I haven’t read MegaShift, sounds great. I have great respect for those who take their spiritual gifts and go out and serve instead of setting up a ministry and attempting to build a name for themselves.

barb,
My husband says when God’s spirit touches flesh, crazy stuff is bound to happen. I’m pretty open to whatever crazy stuff might happen, but I am quite skeptical about the people on stage directing and profiting from it all.

bill,
What saddens me the most is to have this presented to the world as the picture of revival. I still believe there could be something so much more powerful and so much less ridiculous.

rose,
I really appreciated your comment. That is exactly how I feel about this. There is no denying the real experiences of healing and transformation that can occur in the midst of crazy encounters with the spirit.

Perhaps adding a missional perspective would help to resolve the abuse – empowering for the purpose of mission. That may initially be about individual healing and deliverance, yet directed towards greater wholeness for the purpose of loving and serving others.

Amen Sarah!

mike,
I left a comment on one of the earlier posts. It pretty much covered my thoughts on the subject.

I feel uncomfortable when people try to pin me in one camp or the other. (If you don’t agree with me, and accept everything that’s happening here as God, then you’re religious. If you don’t agree with me, and are open to the possibility that any of this is God, then you’re controlling – trying to say “judge not!”).

I think we need to hear from God ourselves on this one. In that way, we could all take this opportunity to ask God to develop and mature our own discernment, rather than relying on others. So, by all means – everyone judge for yourself. But I may or may not come away with the same conclusions as you. And there’s freedom for that!

Here’s a good quote from John Armstrong from his blog this morning, (referring to the apparent love of young people for Obama)

I just wish the Church was so in love with Christ, and then with one another and our kingdom message, that we offered them a far better (eternal) alternative by which to make a huge historical difference. Unless the Lord creates real renewal, and I mean congregation changing awakenings all across the land, I do not expect this young generation to see the Church very positively in the near future. This could all change, and I think it will at some tipping point, but it does not yet appear to be the case in the immediate future.

I’m not sure that the Crowder gang or TB are the “real revival” the church needs. They may be fun, like the circus is fun – but in the end, when the circus leaves town – who gets to deal with the elephant poop? (Perhaps that last line is indicative of why I haven’t been blogging much lately.)

I just made Marsh/Husband look at a video posted on Zoecarnate (he is interviewing John Crowder – New Mystics) (excellent interview btw) In so many ways I love some of the things that John is saying but I was simply sickened by the video. But Marsh gives really wide berth to the whole thing. He always has a “Yeah, but what if..” something to add to the discussion. He really has very few boxes and therefore it drives me nuts. I think that personally, I’m not going to go to a meeting and participate in it but neither am I going to throw stones at it anymore if I’m not directly invovled and responsible for it.

There are Healing Rooms (Cal Pierce – Spokane, Wa – HealingRooms.com – springing up in various parts of the country (US) now (maybe Canada too) – we like teaming up with these people when we can find them. Mostly they’ve attracted the workers of mircales and gifts of healings people (1 Cor 12:28). One of those houses is right next to a Walmart – their testimonies were really awesome. Now that would be pretty fun standing in front of the pharmacy at Walmart and praying for people. I was just in one of those yesterday – wow – talk about culture shock.

Lastly – there is guy names Henry Wright (pleasantvalleychurch.net) – where they have some diseases they claim to have 100% success with. Here’s the kicker though – it’s a James 5:16 type of ministry. Repent from your sins – and God will heal you. They lay it out very graciously – and it is wonderfully effective in certain illnesses. Breast Cancer is one they’ve had a whole lot of success with. (i.e. Bittnerness toward your mother is one cause – there are others – Repent for the bitterness toward your mom – and miraculuously – God removes the cancer)

In the case of Cal Pierce, and Henry Wright – these people have pretty much dedicated their whole life to seeking the healing provisions of the scriptures. Not too much hype there – just tons of prayer and a lot of hard work.